PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relevant.

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PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relevant.

Postby FrostyGoblin » Fri 22 May, 2015 02:10

Hello frien... Hello fellow forum users.

Today i'm going to be talking to you about relevancy, and specifically the current situation of everyones favourite, somehow alive guild, Qjump!

First we need to establish the metrics of what makes a guild relevant in Astroempires. Here are just a few basic things one needs to keep in mind when deciding if someone is relevant.

Combat Control: This one is quite big so we have to break it down into 3 different sub-categories.
  • Galaxy - Are you in possession of atleast 30-40% of the galaxy bases/fleet? Then you can say that you are relevant to the galaxy.
    Cluster - Same as the last one I like to think of 30-40% as a good metric, but fleet is more important than earlier as you can have twice the bases of someone else but still be completely irrelevant if they have 3 times your fleet.
    Server-wide - This one depends more on how you interact with the rest of the server, say that the server has 4 clusters and you only have 10% of the server fleet you're gonna be relevant in a farmland way.
Political Control: This one is entirely up to your GM, if he's good at leading he will naturally get good political control. Because of the long history of this game and how the player base knows each other this can often be very straight forward since most groups that end up becoming combat dominant preplan server starts. Take your average household GM like Balor, he's one of the most notorious names in recent AE History. His relations with most of the existing groups are already known and laid out. He already has a severe advantage on the political level, he has: A. Won many tactical battles, earning him respect in the strategical department. B. A solid core of loyal members which makes having him on your side good as you can most likely assume that his guild can consistently pull off 80% syncs.
Compare this to me for example, going into this server I have GM'd a total of one server and VGM'd 2. While I have won some tactical battles my Curriculum Vitae is not anything close to his and while I do have a core of loyal friends which I would rate extremely highly they are nowhere close to the sheer amount of players that Balor can pull. So while I could (And did) pick a random galaxy and most likely get control of it, I would in the end lose out to someone like Balor due to sheer size and notoriety.

Political control because of this is very hard to establish, while you may have more favourable alliances at the time, your enemies name on its own can easily make your current friends waver and turn side. Another factor that makes it hard to establish this is backroom diplomacy. Unless you are in that backroom, you don't know the true nature of the diplomacy. And that's why when analyzing political control we can only go on 2 factors when judging this. GM capability and Official pacts.

Now we come to the application of this to QJump, I'm going to be as unbiased as I possibly can when applying this.

QJump Combat Control:
When it comes to galaxy control QJump has a few galaxies going for them although only 15 can be described as their galaxy as 14, 16, and 17 are shared by Saint. Looking at Cluster size the make up roughly 20% of the teens fleet. Server-wide they control 5% of the fleet. (Note: I only counted guilds with more than 10 million in fleet.) Looking at Combat control alone they are struggling to stay relevant in the cluster. Having just 20% of the fleet makes it hard for you to have any sort of diplomatic leverage, which brings us to the next point.

QJump Political Control:
As established earlier a big part of this comes down to your GM and how he's like. My first question is who the *beep* is Indiko? I've literally never heard of this guy before, did he just pop up in some 2.0 server when I wasn't looking? His forum account was literally created 2 months ago. If I don't know who he is, and trust me when I say that I know who most people are, it's looking bad for your notoriety. However TJ said he liked Indiko so that means he atleast got on the good side of one of the Saint GM's so I can't be too harsh.
When it comes to official pacts as far as I know the only pact they have is with Saint and obviously Saints sub guild Angel. And since they don't have combat control they aren't the ones in charge of the teens ship and wont be the ones making the external pacts for the cluster.

So in summary, Qjump are not relevant outside of 4 galaxies because they don't have the military or political powers to challenge the top dog of the cluster let alone other clusters.

Now if you'll excuse me it's late and i'm getting mentally drained from making dank walls of texts.

Retired servers: N: WTF?, O: sIMPire, P: Royal, A2: xoxo, B2: Ayy, C2: LEWD!, Q: YURI!, D2: LF, E2: 3SUM, F2: PPD, R: Frank, G2: Mayu, H2: STARK, I2: CQC, S: SMUG! | Forced Labour: J2: KS, K2: FTW
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Re: PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relev

Postby TrueJustice » Fri 22 May, 2015 03:03

Who cares? Look at all these nom noms! :dance:

Let's clean this crap up
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Re: PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relev

Postby Snozberriez » Fri 22 May, 2015 03:22

:shock: who the f*ck is indiko??? :whisle:

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Re: PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relev

Postby Indiko » Fri 22 May, 2015 03:43

Snozberriez wrote: :shock: who the f*ck is indiko??? :whisle:
:wink:

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Re: PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relev

Postby Linker591 » Fri 22 May, 2015 15:46

Tldr


Doesn't making a forum post about an irrelevant guild commenting on how irrelevant it is, make it relevant? Like the fact that you took time to point out its irrelevancy does actually make it relevant.
Also idk who Indiko is, but I know if you swap the "K" to a "G" you get Indigo which is a color. Unfortunately that is not a known color either.

If it leaves a hole...you need a bigger gun.
My comments are in no way related to my guild diplomacy,
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Re: PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relev

Postby FrostyGoblin » Fri 22 May, 2015 16:08

Linker591 wrote:Tldr


Doesn't making a forum post about an irrelevant guild commenting on how irrelevant it is, make it relevant? Like the fact that you took time to point out its irrelevancy does actually make it relevant.
Also idk who Indiko is, but I know if you swap the "K" to a "G" you get Indigo which is a color. Unfortunately that is not a known color either.
No, that's a completely retarded assertion. Were they relevant to my argument? Yes. Are they relevant in any other sense? Not really.

Retired servers: N: WTF?, O: sIMPire, P: Royal, A2: xoxo, B2: Ayy, C2: LEWD!, Q: YURI!, D2: LF, E2: 3SUM, F2: PPD, R: Frank, G2: Mayu, H2: STARK, I2: CQC, S: SMUG! | Forced Labour: J2: KS, K2: FTW
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Re: PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relev

Postby fendelius » Fri 22 May, 2015 16:38

they must haz sum forum warriors 2... 8-)

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Re: PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relev

Postby Hayley » Fri 22 May, 2015 16:52

Curious, would you say they are more or less relevant than YURI ? ;)

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Re: PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relev

Postby Linker591 » Fri 22 May, 2015 18:03

FrostyGoblin wrote:
Linker591 wrote:Tldr


Doesn't making a forum post about an irrelevant guild commenting on how irrelevant it is, make it relevant? Like the fact that you took time to point out its irrelevancy does actually make it relevant.
Also idk who Indiko is, but I know if you swap the "K" to a "G" you get Indigo which is a color. Unfortunately that is not a known color either.
No, that's a completely retarded assertion. Were they relevant to my argument? Yes. Are they relevant in any other sense? Not really.
I was joking...you dint have to bite my head off.
but on a more serious note. Perhaps not relevant in the sense of fleet or fighting capabiliTy. However, I would say they played a big part in elite getting wiped out.
obviously I'm not part of any ls, and all I heard were rumors. However, based on those rumors, if it wasn't for qjump, maybe saint wouldn't have eaten them?
The ability for qjump, such a disrganized guild to wipe out so much of elite, showed saints that elite under its ls was not useful to keep around.
I would also say that the backstabbing of qjump by elite last time also increased tensions.
and perhaps though not assertable, the whOle spying and trying to turn saints on qjump by elite also made saints turn on elite.
just saying, you can't measure relevancy simply on the factor of fleet or how much people know the leader

If it leaves a hole...you need a bigger gun.
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Re: PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relev

Postby FrostyGoblin » Fri 22 May, 2015 19:14

Hayley wrote:Curious, would you say they are more or less relevant than YURI ? ;)
We here at Youthful Urges, Rarely Inocent! Incorporated like to run thingsfrom the shadows, we secretely own the server, only true innitiates know :paranoid: .

Retired servers: N: WTF?, O: sIMPire, P: Royal, A2: xoxo, B2: Ayy, C2: LEWD!, Q: YURI!, D2: LF, E2: 3SUM, F2: PPD, R: Frank, G2: Mayu, H2: STARK, I2: CQC, S: SMUG! | Forced Labour: J2: KS, K2: FTW
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Re: PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relev

Postby Burgess » Fri 22 May, 2015 20:00

Hayley wrote:Curious, would you say they are more or less relevant than YURI ? ;)
Unbiased less relevant. Period. Hate to admit but /truth

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Re: PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relev

Postby FrostyGoblin » Fri 22 May, 2015 21:46

Burgess wrote:
Hayley wrote:Curious, would you say they are more or less relevant than YURI ? ;)
Unbiased less relevant. Period. Hate to admit but /truth
Someone is just jelly that he missed the opportunity to be a part of YURI!

Retired servers: N: WTF?, O: sIMPire, P: Royal, A2: xoxo, B2: Ayy, C2: LEWD!, Q: YURI!, D2: LF, E2: 3SUM, F2: PPD, R: Frank, G2: Mayu, H2: STARK, I2: CQC, S: SMUG! | Forced Labour: J2: KS, K2: FTW
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Re: PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relev

Postby TRACE » Fri 22 May, 2015 22:08

Who are Yuri ?? :eh:

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Re: PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relev

Postby fendelius » Fri 22 May, 2015 23:09

u cant use da word jelly without addex bein around... but somehow he seems to be absent from these threads??

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Re: PSA: Being on the winning side doesn't equal being relev

Postby ashtraynaut » Sat 23 May, 2015 01:46

FrostyGoblin wrote:Hello frien... Hello fellow forum users.

Today i'm going to be talking to you about relevancy, and specifically the current situation of everyones favourite, somehow alive guild, Qjump!

First we need to establish the metrics of what makes a guild relevant in Astroempires. Here are just a few basic things one needs to keep in mind when deciding if someone is relevant.

Combat Control: This one is quite big so we have to break it down into 3 different sub-categories.
  • Galaxy - Are you in possession of atleast 30-40% of the galaxy bases/fleet? Then you can say that you are relevant to the galaxy.
    Cluster - Same as the last one I like to think of 30-40% as a good metric, but fleet is more important than earlier as you can have twice the bases of someone else but still be completely irrelevant if they have 3 times your fleet.
    Server-wide - This one depends more on how you interact with the rest of the server, say that the server has 4 clusters and you only have 10% of the server fleet you're gonna be relevant in a farmland way.
Political Control: This one is entirely up to your GM, if he's good at leading he will naturally get good political control. Because of the long history of this game and how the player base knows each other this can often be very straight forward since most groups that end up becoming combat dominant preplan server starts. Take your average household GM like Balor, he's one of the most notorious names in recent AE History. His relations with most of the existing groups are already known and laid out. He already has a severe advantage on the political level, he has: A. Won many tactical battles, earning him respect in the strategical department. B. A solid core of loyal members which makes having him on your side good as you can most likely assume that his guild can consistently pull off 80% syncs.
Compare this to me for example, going into this server I have GM'd a total of one server and VGM'd 2. While I have won some tactical battles my Curriculum Vitae is not anything close to his and while I do have a core of loyal friends which I would rate extremely highly they are nowhere close to the sheer amount of players that Balor can pull. So while I could (And did) pick a random galaxy and most likely get control of it, I would in the end lose out to someone like Balor due to sheer size and notoriety.

Political control because of this is very hard to establish, while you may have more favourable alliances at the time, your enemies name on its own can easily make your current friends waver and turn side. Another factor that makes it hard to establish this is backroom diplomacy. Unless you are in that backroom, you don't know the true nature of the diplomacy. And that's why when analyzing political control we can only go on 2 factors when judging this. GM capability and Official pacts.

Now we come to the application of this to QJump, I'm going to be as unbiased as I possibly can when applying this.

QJump Combat Control:
When it comes to galaxy control QJump has a few galaxies going for them although only 15 can be described as their galaxy as 14, 16, and 17 are shared by Saint. Looking at Cluster size the make up roughly 20% of the teens fleet. Server-wide they control 5% of the fleet. (Note: I only counted guilds with more than 10 million in fleet.) Looking at Combat control alone they are struggling to stay relevant in the cluster. Having just 20% of the fleet makes it hard for you to have any sort of diplomatic leverage, which brings us to the next point.

QJump Political Control:
As established earlier a big part of this comes down to your GM and how he's like. My first question is who the *beep* is Indiko? I've literally never heard of this guy before, did he just pop up in some 2.0 server when I wasn't looking? His forum account was literally created 2 months ago. If I don't know who he is, and trust me when I say that I know who most people are, it's looking bad for your notoriety. However TJ said he liked Indiko so that means he atleast got on the good side of one of the Saint GM's so I can't be too harsh.
When it comes to official pacts as far as I know the only pact they have is with Saint and obviously Saints sub guild Angel. And since they don't have combat control they aren't the ones in charge of the teens ship and wont be the ones making the external pacts for the cluster.

So in summary, Qjump are not relevant outside of 4 galaxies because they don't have the military or political powers to challenge the top dog of the cluster let alone other clusters.

Now if you'll excuse me it's late and i'm getting mentally drained from making dank walls of texts.
how are you, by any chance, relevant for anyone in this forum or the server?
back to your cave bro.

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