Epsilon Server War #5

[macbro]

I'm just basing my post off of the example that you submitted. You suggested the second variable. Nothing can be proven here, in the end it becomes pointless and a waste of time.

[Winchester]

I'm just basing my post off of the example that you submitted. You suggested the second variable. Nothing can be proven here, in the end it becomes pointless and a waste of time.

You alluded to the notion that they are responsible in one form or another, simply because that's what my alternative option stated. There is no support for such a claim, whether it is explicit or implicit, which makes your post empty and meaningless.

[Carnage 101]

Alright lets discuss this in another way, dissension among CAT ranks.

Following the loss of the second server war there was a lot of infighting, restructuring, cannibalization, and most important loss of small and large allies who for whatever reason just could not make things work out.

Also the repeated small losses (some were actually big) at the hands of both FTW/RED and SWAG put further stress on the already volatile relationship. Moderate level of activity was not sufficient to survive. Even leadership was frustrated at the lack of following orders.

In the end just before war small allies were alienated and left the war on neutral terms though were derbed for abandonment.

Now after all of this are you Prespa trying to tell us that there was no one among your own who would have been more than happy to suicide into you guys. People who were anyway ready to leave the game for good? Also on our side the suicides did come from SiN players but instructions went out immediately to change passwords incase they were shared among former "friends". Following that there were no more suicidal incidents. The accounts that committed the crime were vouched for by the rest of their guild. Situation solved.

Now no one in their right mind would attack another guild on an even footing. It makes no sense to allow a 50% chance that your enemy would win. Yes we allied whoever we found could support us and made a huge blob and our leadership worked hard to successfully mobilize everyone on time. The results speak for themselves

This war was not a blob crash but a culmination of incidents and planning that took months to successfully accomplish. Give credit where credit is due. You guys lost plain and simple and you would be living in dream land if you were expecting the outcome any other way. Our leader anticipated the activity, spies, intel leak, lag times, scenarios and even suicides but what we didn't anticipate was doubling fleet, complete vanishing of fleet server down time. We will anticipate that next time.

So now well played and hope to see you soon which ever side you choose to side with. I will leave you with our guild motto which really should be taken seriously

"We do your stuff nearly as well as you do, you can't do ours very well at all, and we do everything that we both don't do much better than you can. Not very humble, I know, but true"

[Dro]

Exactly he said it himself that half the guys were going to delete so why not slam them into the people who caused them to have to quit

[prespa]

Walls of text, trolling, lessons in logic,... You guys are good

I congratulate you on your Post Ribentrop, you really made an effort to explain to us how logic works. Have you checked your family tree? Is Sherlock Holmes there somewhere? There are countless possibilities, maybe 6 is not cheating or a spy, maybe some mind reading aliens did it for some reason that we can't understand. They can easily find our login infos and suicide while we are sleeping

@albend: I'm not and I never was a sore looser. I was in blob wars both on the winning side and on the losing side, too, but I never complained (search my posts on the forums if you like). I was angry that the things that happened were completely unnecessary and couldn't change the outcome, but still they happened.

Anyway, what happened happened, some ppl did stuff and they know why and how they did it. Shame on them

I think I made my point so far, some ppl agree with me, some not and that's OK. If we all agree on everything we wouldn't be humans

[knightmares]

It's odd. In two threads, like 10-12 pages combined. I have not heard a single invite to the stomping grounds of 3SUM. Usually these guys are a friendly bunch and will accept visitors. Not now. I suppose they're trying to stay in character for the forum-warrior mission. Since un-bias is not what they are looking for and more so consolation for their losses.... perhaps someone should create a separate thread dubbed "Funeral Of CAT" or what may be truly appropriate and then we can actually separate logic from e-tears.

I can't be bothered arguing about the suicides so i will address this. I am sure if someone like Jim reformed 3SUM we would be much of the same however most of 3SUM is gone for varying reasons and so we seem to be stuck in LUKE.

edit: I feel i should quickly point carnage to superme who has had all his bases deleted and since joined back with us, I doubt you can argue dissent in the ranks in that case. tho i do agree credit to ftw/sin/swag for outplaying us.

[Dro]

Results from the war blue+white color vs red color

[Glennus]

There were suicides on our blob this morning as well. Are we going to sit here and go OOOH LUKE DID IT?

No. We sucked it up, took out the rest of the fleet from those accounts and went on with our day.

While I am sure it completely sucks for you to have lost some of your fleets that way, perhaps some of you people were just tired of the game and decided to add some unneeded drama to the war. Not everything is a huge conspiracy against you.

lol, they were sinner fleets destroying swag trash fleets, not exactly game changing and not nearly equivalent in their scope. You don't have to blame anyone for cheating, everyone knows you can't trust a sinner any further than you can throw them. In fact, why you ex-goons threw in with them is beyond me.

it must have been an EPIC b*tch fit between oth and krull

[Ephesians]

Carnage posted the most vailid point in this whole thread thus far.

We lost the E29 battle because of a poor tactical decision to assault an enemy blob that was the same size as our own. After losing the E29 server war, FTW lost several members as is typically following any server war, however we did not give up. We were all determined to rebuild and regain our seat at the top of the server because we all knew that we were better than the fail performance that we put on in E29.

In E17, FTW was faced with what we thought to be impossible odds. We were outnumberd, out speced, and morale was low. Still, every one of our members gave everything they had during that final battle. Wave after wave for 24 hrs, people stayed online F5-ing and popping incoming enemy fleets. By staying on our blob we were able to use our inactive fleets as meatshields and decoy targets.

Even after the E17 crash, both alliance fleet sizes on either side were still very much even and both sides had to completely rebuild their fleets from scratch. The difference was that FTW was ordered to include carriers/fc in their finisher attacks whereas many TITANco players were able to pull theirs out alive. Yes, FTWco won the pile and were able to rebuild more easily, but TITANco had the head start because they did not need to rebuild FC, so they were still very much on par as far as total fleet goes.

What people are overlooking now, is the fact that this past server war did not start this weekend, it started months and months ago and has been going on since a couple months after the E17 crash. As i mentioned previously, immediately following E17, both alliance fleets were very much even. The reason LUKE was so outnumbered in E49 was a result of 2 things that occured between E17 and E49: #1 poor politics and #2 poor activity.

A huge turning point in this past sever war occured when SIN was alianate from the TITANco alliance. This E49 battle would have turned out very differently and more than likely would not have happened at all if SIN (and as a result, SW) were to have remained on the other side instead of joining FTWco. That would have given LUKEco and additional 2b+ fleet and takend 2b+ fleet away from FTWco, which would have resulted in a 12b vs 16b face off instead of 10b vs 18b.

After SIN joined FTWco, the numerical advantage was ours and we were able to take more risks and be more aggressive in pursuing the CATco blob. Every time CAT moved, FTW/RED would come. CAT did a great job in denying RED derbs by killing off thier own inactives. Still, every time they moved, they would lose ~100m-300m fleet each time. Add this over over the course of 5-6 moves and it becomes a significant number of fleet lost in CAT for zero losses to RED/FTW.

It was because of these 2 reasons (SIN being alianated and constant derbing of inactives) that FTWco was able to have the advantage that we had in E49. Leadership and members both had invested far more time and effort planning, coordinating, and executing the politics and constant secret launches to chase CATco around the server. Then one day PEN got overconfident and made a poor launch to E09. RED/FTW were able to take advantage of this mistake and force the month long blob off while we waited for our JG to build next door to the LUKE blob.

The poor decision by LUKE leadership to constest our landing next door made the final crash significantly easier for use to execute the final assault. That move eliminated LUKE's ability to use inactive fleets as meatshields and decoy targets. Had they waited it out and fought on the blob, I am certain that several more TT/SWAG fleets would have been destroyed. Im certain that TT/SWAG still would have won the pile in the end, but im also certain that we would not have won the battle on the first wave. It could have easily taken us 2-3 hrs to coordinate waves of attacks to kill all the enemy fleets on the blob which would mean 2-3 ticks of derbs that they could have collected.




TL;DR:

This victory did not occur in 1 day, it occured over time across a series of chess moves over the past months. After a substantial ammount of effort put forth by leaders and members of the FTWco alliance alike up to this point, the final battle was merely just putting the final nail in the coffin.

[Glennus]

The question on everyone's mind now is: what happens now?
Is Epsilon a viable server after the outcome of this battle, since it seems unlikely FTWco will completely break down into it's original factions.

The war has drawn a lot of people together against some of the less-liked LUKE leadership. Is this the end, or can FTW turn a victory of this scope into an opportunity to refactionalize the server?

[Hard^Rock]

Then one day PEN got overconfident and made a poor launch to E09. RED/FTW were able to take advantage of this mistake and force the month long blob off while we waited for our JG to build next door to the LUKE blob.

Its all about this Fail move . they put their allies in that situation .

[Ephesians]

The question on everyone's mind now is: what happens now?
Is Epsilon a viable server after the outcome of this battle, since it seems unlikely FTWco will completely break down into it's original factions.

The war has drawn a lot of people together against some of the less-liked LUKE leadership. Is this the end, or can FTW turn a victory of this scope into an opportunity to refactionalize the server?

The players who made up the TT/SWAG blob guilds will all be going back to their home guilds and be off on their separate ways. Inactives will be kickfarmed and dead weight will be cut as usual. The TT/SWAG side of the server will certainly be doing their part in keeping the sever alive.

The real question is whether the LUKE side of the server will pick their heads up out of the dirt and rebuild and fight back like they did after E17 or will they just give up their 3 years of hard work and let the server become unbalanced.

[prespa]

Ephesians, Epsi is unballanced and we can do nothing to balanced it again. As I said before AE is game of numbers and numbers we're on your side before the crash and will be even more after few months of rebuilding.

The ball is in your court now. If you decide to split into several smaller guilds without signing pacts, server will live. If not, Epsi will become lolEpsi and everyone who is not in your bloc will be derbed sooner or later.

[Perun]

The real question is whether the LUKE side of the server will pick their heads up out of the dirt and rebuild and fight back like they did after E17 or will they just give up their 3 years of hard work and let the server become unbalanced.

So you want to fight us again ?

I really dont get it why would you want to fight same people again ? You hate someone that much or what ?

Its finally time for this server to change and you are winners so change something, its up to you, sure i will rebuild and if you expect me to fight same war again i can tell you now what will happen but ill just keep if for myself until i see how things happen.

One sided server is incredibly boring thing to have

[Carnage 101]

@Perun: You need a good diplomat and a set of policies that support your allies. Allies always change and that's good for you. Would there be a chance of a major event like this?.... probably not, but will there be smaller more challenging battles? ....Hell yes. You guys have the experience and the accounts built already. Just need the time and the cunning to make it work out.